Comments for Ken's Blog http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken views from a non-disease perspective Mon, 06 Sep 2010 10:18:03 +0000 http://wordpress.org/ Comment on The Pharmocatherapy of Malingering by Paul http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/2008/07/the-pharmocatherapy-of-malingering/#comment-8 Paul Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:36:45 +0000 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/?p=5#comment-8 What a droll sense of humor! What a droll sense of humor!

]]> Comment on Another Response to “Agent Green” by admin http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/2008/06/another-response-to-agent-green/#comment-7 admin Mon, 23 Jun 2008 16:57:03 +0000 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/?p=4#comment-7 Syncronicity, I think Dr. Edgar P. Nace, despite having "Dr." before his name, is far more aptly described as a man of 12-Step religion than a man of science. Ken Ragge Syncronicity,
I think Dr. Edgar P. Nace, despite having “Dr.” before his name, is far more aptly described as a man of 12-Step religion than a man of science.
Ken Ragge

]]> Comment on Another Response to “Agent Green” by Syncronicity7 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/2008/06/another-response-to-agent-green/#comment-6 Syncronicity7 Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:37:43 +0000 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/?p=4#comment-6 Thanks for the blog about Agent Green. It illustrates how groupers/steppers like Agent Green will defend AA with any means possible including absurd and illogical arguments. I think they somehow feel threatened by new views, and so fight rather than accept (i.e. they don't practice their own program). The quote from Dr. Edgar P. Nace which can be paraphrased as: "show the patient to AA", or "if he would rather quit on his own" is a grossly absurd line of reasoning. It implies either a. AA or b. you are on your own. That is logically incorrect; how can a man of science use logically incorrect reasoning! There are only 2 possibilities, 1. his thinking is tainted by AA, or 2. he will use unethical means to defend his position. Roland Thanks for the blog about Agent Green. It illustrates how groupers/steppers like Agent Green will defend AA with any means possible including absurd and illogical arguments. I think they somehow feel threatened by new views, and so fight rather than accept (i.e. they don’t practice their own program).

The quote from Dr. Edgar P. Nace which can be paraphrased as: “show the patient to AA”, or “if he would rather quit on his own” is a grossly absurd line of reasoning. It implies either a. AA or b. you are on your own. That is logically incorrect; how can a man of science use logically incorrect reasoning! There are only 2 possibilities, 1. his thinking is tainted by AA, or 2. he will use unethical means to defend his position.

Roland

]]> Comment on The Strange World of Mark Dombeck, Ph.D. at MentalHealth.net by » The Strange World of Mark Dombeck, Ph.D. at MentalHealth.net http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/2008/06/the-strange-world-of-mark-dombeck-phd-at-mentalhealthnet/#comment-5 » The Strange World of Mark Dombeck, Ph.D. at MentalHealth.net Mon, 23 Jun 2008 01:56:39 +0000 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/?p=3#comment-5 [...] [Technorati] Tag results for mental health wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerpt For quite some time I’ve wanted to respond to the writings of Mark Dombeck at mentalhealth.net but have been constrained by time. Now that I have some time, I’m rather stumped. The reason for this is that rather than wanting to respond to one outlandish article, I’m now in the position of trying to respond to a series of articles written by Dombeck that so resembles a series of arguments on why some particular number of angels can dance on the head of a pin. How does one respond to pages and pa [...] [...] [Technorati] Tag results for mental health wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerpt For quite some time I’ve wanted to respond to the writings of Mark Dombeck at mentalhealth.net but have been constrained by time. Now that I have some time, I’m rather stumped. The reason for this is that rather than wanting to respond to one outlandish article, I’m now in the position of trying to respond to a series of articles written by Dombeck that so resembles a series of arguments on why some particular number of angels can dance on the head of a pin. How does one respond to pages and pa [...]

]]> Comment on The Strange World of Mark Dombeck, Ph.D. at MentalHealth.net by utility1 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/2008/06/the-strange-world-of-mark-dombeck-phd-at-mentalhealthnet/#comment-4 utility1 Mon, 23 Jun 2008 01:00:11 +0000 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/?p=3#comment-4 Comment: Alice in Wonderland indeed--It's clear Dombeck has spent a bit too much time down that proverbial rabbit hole. Thanks for this fascinating and detailed reply to such a preposterous essay suspiciously bent on selling AA once again. The truth is AA is to shame as a magnet is to steel. In the 12-Steps, 'defects' are the order of the day and praying to have them removed (as if one could!) is the sole focus. One is psychically stuck in a hamster's cage of a day late and a dollar short called 'Not Enough': not enough prayer, not enough meetings, not enough honesty, not enough humility, not enough gratitude, not enough amends, not enough following direction, not enough service, not enough carrying the message (read prosletyzing). If this doesn't add up to shame induction, I don't know what does. Comment:
Alice in Wonderland indeed–It’s clear Dombeck has spent a bit too much time down that proverbial rabbit hole.

Thanks for this fascinating and detailed reply to such a preposterous essay suspiciously bent on selling AA once again.

The truth is AA is to shame as a magnet is to steel.

In the 12-Steps, ‘defects’ are the order of the day and praying to have them removed (as if one could!) is the sole focus. One is psychically stuck in a hamster’s cage of a day late and a dollar short called

‘Not Enough’:

not enough prayer, not enough meetings, not enough honesty, not enough humility, not enough gratitude, not enough amends, not enough following direction, not enough service, not enough carrying the message (read prosletyzing).

If this doesn’t add up to shame induction, I don’t know what does.

]]> Comment on The Strange World of Mark Dombeck, Ph.D. at MentalHealth.net by utility1 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/2008/06/the-strange-world-of-mark-dombeck-phd-at-mentalhealthnet/#comment-3 utility1 Mon, 23 Jun 2008 00:59:23 +0000 http://www.morerevealed.com/blogs/ken/?p=3#comment-3 Comment: Hey, Ken, Good to see you back in the salt mines. I posted a response very similar to this one on one of the groups. No worries on the diminishment of your compositional skills. You haven't lost a beat. Your efforts with the dismissive guru is a hard call. How much time should you devote to one messenger when that message is the same from thousands? Trying to put out individual fires must soon become maddening, I would think. Guys like you and Orange and Peele and the others all have better kung-fu than the gurus, talking heads, and spin doctors, who offer up nothing other than false wisdom, faith-healing, testimonials, and dogma. They cannot argue facts, so they dismiss, belittle, brow-beat, name-call, and then cry "AA Basher" at the top of their lungs. We (those who dare to disagree) are dismissed as angry, twisted, hateful, uninformed, close-minded and " dangerous to the new-comer". The mantra remains unchanged. The Bigbook is perfect. The program is perfect. The steps are perfect. We stupid drunks, close-minded and unwilling, are the reasons AA fails. If we disagree with the traditional wisdom, we are by definition egotistical, self-seeking, and doomed to inevitable relapse and death. The way AA treated Kishline speaks volumes for how they are. That is how perceived critics, back-sliders, and those who question are always treated. AA takes credit for their accomplishments, then blames them for their set-backs. Like I said, I don't know how much time you can spend on one a****le, when there are thousands spewing the same toxic message. Thanks for all your efforts, here and everywhere, and keep that creative machine lubricated. You do nice work. Regards, Mike Comment:
Hey, Ken,
Good to see you back in the salt mines. I posted a response very similar to this one on one of the groups.
No worries on the diminishment of your compositional skills. You haven’t lost a beat.
Your efforts with the dismissive guru is a hard call. How much time should you devote to one messenger when that message is the same from thousands? Trying to put out individual fires must soon become maddening, I would think. Guys like you and Orange and Peele and the others all have better kung-fu than the gurus, talking heads, and spin doctors, who offer up nothing other than false wisdom, faith-healing, testimonials, and dogma. They cannot argue facts, so they dismiss, belittle, brow-beat, name-call, and then cry “AA Basher” at the top of their lungs. We (those who dare to disagree) are dismissed as angry, twisted, hateful, uninformed, close-minded and ” dangerous to the new-comer”.
The mantra remains unchanged. The Bigbook is perfect. The program is perfect. The steps are perfect. We stupid drunks, close-minded and unwilling, are the reasons AA fails. If we disagree with the traditional wisdom, we are by definition egotistical, self-seeking, and doomed to inevitable relapse and death.
The way AA treated Kishline speaks volumes for how they are. That is how perceived critics, back-sliders, and those who question are always treated. AA takes credit for their accomplishments, then blames them for their set-backs.
Like I said, I don’t know how much time you can spend on one a****le, when there are thousands spewing the same toxic message.
Thanks for all your efforts, here and everywhere, and keep that creative machine lubricated. You do nice work. Regards, Mike

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